Ray Butts Echosonic #27

[Echosonic27]

Hello everyone! I am new to this forum and I am the owner of Ray Butts's EchoSonic #27. It has never been modified and works well. After a bit of internet research, it may have been possible that Ray had kept a card file with details on each amp he made. Does anyone have any information on the year of this amp, who bought it, date of purchase, etc? I was told that this may have been Ricky Nelson's amp but that is as of yet unconfirmed. This amp has some issues - is there a schematic and/or parts list available for reference? I can be reached at echosonic27 at gmail dot com. Any information on this historical amplifier would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

[tictac]

No info on this amp available on the web AFAIK.

If you could post some gut shots we may be able to help you make a schematic...

TT

[xtian]

Looks cool! Is the echo actually reverb? What are the issues? We'd love to see gutshots.

[ToneMerc]

Removed Ray Butts patent drawings and docs.

[xtian]

Are. You. Telling. Me. This thing has a tape loop for echoes with a wing nut to adjust the repeat rate?!?

[Echosonic27]

Yes, the Echosonic amps sported a tape echo in the bottom of the amp mounted on a wooden board. But the delay time could not be adjusted, as the heads were screwed into the metal plates that are mounted to the surface of the board. Here's a photo of a later Echosonic amp tape delay board that I restored

[Kregg]

I boned up on this a few years back and I found the links and such on Scotty Moore's website very interesting. http://www.scottymoore.net/echosonic.html

[Echosonic27]

Very interesting ..........

http://173.203.78.138/forum/other-amps/ ... 017/page1/



Here's the post:


I was the guy who bought this 1961 Rickenbacker Ek-O-Sound model M-30. The amp never sold on eBay due to the reserve, but I held the highest bid. Anyone wanting to see the Complete Restoration of this amp and its echo tape board in detail are welcome to visit one of the many forums to which I posted the entire process:


http://www.rickresource.com/forum/viewt ... 1&start=30


At the time, Dave Kyle had given up on the Ray Butts book because of arguments with Katha Butts-House, and at a time when everyone wanted the stuff left in Randy Butts's basement, I asked if I could take on the book project, and Dave was very receptive and gave the entire rights to the book including the whole manuscript to me. I waited a long time for his accompanying photos, and I also made quite a bit of progress on the book. Then one day, he changed his mind and said he's writing the book with someone else and would not tell me who (but I knew it was Tim..). I granted his wish without a fight because it is the right thing to do. He said that Katha heard that I was writing the book and said I didn't know Ray so she was against me from that point on. What she didn't know is that Randy and I were friends, usually chatting about hunting, fishing, and vintage TV repair. Katha made every effort to make sure that I did not, and it all went to Tim Masters of course. Dave told me not to share any information about these amps with anyone, including people on the internet. This really insulted me and my efforts to try and help others in their Quest For Tone, since this is, after all, the Holy Grail.

Tim emailed me once, saying that he will do everything to keep this amp a secret, in respect to Ray Butts who was known for his amp's secrecy. He claimed that this was a way to Keep Ray's Memory and Music Alive. I can surely tell you that to keep something alive, you need to let it free and let everyone enjoy it. Ray Butts invented it, and needed the money from the amps for his family. Tim didn't invent it and his family isn’t' relying on the amp sales to survive. He bought a used one from eBay, copied it, and is trying to sell his clones to the tune of $6000 but you have to pass his interview. I don't even know of a single sale of his clones, but clearly his respect for Ray's secrecy has a price...... That being said, Tim has many friends that are also my friends, and we obviously share many same obsessions. I am confident that, in his heart, mind and soul, he has the ability to change for the better, and hopefully he will. After all, he got all of Ray's schematics, parts, tools, etc, so only he has the very historical items. It is my opinion that the schematics, etc should be shared with the entire world - now THAT would be Keeping The Music Alive. Despite all his secrecy, and the ensuing friction between us, I do respect you, Tim.....

Interestingly enough, at the time when I was trying to buy this amp, I thought I was going to be ripped off, because the seller was emailing me, claming to be on the telephone with "Someone Representing The Estate Of Deke Dickerson". At first, I didn’t believe this, because I knew that, at the same time, Deke D had this Standel 50L15 Shop Test Amp #2 SN(has # 1096 written inside the cabinet) for sale on Ebay for $5000, saying that he already had another Standel amp (his Emerald Green SN 1032 from Don Snow), and that having 2 Standels 'qualified him for an episode of Hoarders". Well, after reading this post, and seeing that indeed Deke (DDfonic) was looking to buy this amp, I think that there is some truth to this. I also found out recently that Deke bought Scotty Moore's spare Echosonic amp, so now he has 2 of those amps as well. Let's face it Deke - gear collecting isn't hoarding, but it surely made a good excuse to get rid of the test amp.

I do not know which serial # it is. Chet Atkins and other sources claim that Scotty bought Echosonic #03, but the tube chart on his original Echosonic (with the wide front panels) is Serial #08. Deke - If you're reading this, perhaps you remember me emailing you asking for photos of the insides of your Echosonic amp. To that, you said "not much interesting in there", but I'm sure you realize that it is extremely interesting to many many people, and surely as a collector and Echo fan you know this. I didn't push the issue with you out of respect, because I understood you wanted to retain privacy - No Problem!! It would be great to know the serial #s of both your Echosonics. I know that you have the one Ray gave to Rickenbacker and that may have been the last one, so perhaps that one is #68. But without a Ray Butts cabinet, I am not certain that a tube chart with a serial # even exists in that one.

[topbrent]

Grab your digital camera and a screwdriver, crack that baby open.

All this cloak and dagger secrecy BS.

If this amp and its circuit is sacred and secret...you have found the wrong forum.
This is AmpGarage, afterall.

[teemuk]

All this cloak and dagger secrecy BS

Couldn't agree more. What's with all this obsession about some vintage amps just because a bunch of famous guitarists used them during their career.

The only real remarkable feat you'll find from that amp is that it integrated a tape delay, something pretty unique in the late 1950's, not so much after a few years when tape delays, oil can delays and eventually analog integrated delays chips became a commodity. It's pretty revealing that when Rickenbacker finally licensed that patented idea and put the Ray's amp design into mass production in early 1960's no one gave a damn; this thing was crushed by Fenders, Marshalls, Gibsons, Voxes and all the other bread and butter amps in popularity.

There was hardly no famous musicians whatsoever rushing to buy those things.

What makes this stuff famous TODAY is that it has a pretty impressive - albeit extremely short - user list back in the days (but do note that all of the guys who did use it, eventually switched to using other amps like Gibsons and Scotty Moore, for example had his amp hugely modified by Ray), and of course the rarity and secrecy, which keeps this scene rolling.

You have the amp, why do you even need a schematic? A plain tube amp from late 1950's isn't rocket science and who says a schematic even depicts all models accurately, since Ray may have modified a lot of the stuff along the way. The patent will also depict a rough schematic for guidance but it will obviously lack certain circuit parts, which are likely more or less similar to Rickenbacker's version of that amp.

[Reeltarded]

Has this also been posted in the Dumble forum? I haven't looked, but I have been confused by threads in every other forum.

[Structo]

Are you the same guy as TelecasterTech?

[Echosonic27]

Hi Teemuk! Good to see you again! I must thank you again for sending me the patent number of the Ray Butts Echosonic Amp. that really helped me along my quest for information about this amp.

As you all know, there are no good clear photos on the internet or books about the Ray Butts Echosonic amp. So here, for the first time ever, are many good photos for everyone out there, for personal, non-profit, non-commerical, non-educations and non-governmental use. You need written permission from me to publish these in part or in their entirety, or for other uses..). And I won't give you trouble about it either, nor charge you any ridiculous fees or anything like that. I just want to make sure I know where the photos of my amp get published.


Grab ascrewdrier and crack that Baby open...? - You Got It!!!

[Echosonic27]

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[Echosonic27]

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